- --- IRC log started on Mon Jun 20 18:01:36 2005
- <stockholm> dont we have 17:00 UTC now?
- <nchip> yeah
- <Q-FUNK> 17:05
- <h01ger> hi - excuse me, was outside..
- <h01ger> did everybody read http://wiki.debian.net/?DebConf5TechMeetingAgenda ?
- <h01ger> maybe we should wait til 17.30 UTC so mooch is here as well ? without mooch and liiwi its much less usefull...
- <h01ger> nchip, ok, thanks. will keep that (both) in mind..
- <liiwi> hrm
- <h01ger> stockholm, http://layer-acht.org/fai-files/
- <h01ger> ah, hi liiwi, /me had difficulties parsing "oh fuck" of yours :)
- <h01ger> or we could start with the list of machines. mooch is not that involved in it and will happily take the results i guess ;)
- <stockholm> i have one machine for sure
- <h01ger> stockholm, which one ?
- <liiwi> got caught with work, and thought it would take all evening
- <Q-FUNK> N D1D2N ND3DpDm
- <Q-FUNK> oops
- <stockholm> a dual opteron server
- <stockholm> 2Gig RAM
- --- h01ger has changed the topic on channel #debconf-team to "techmeeting - list of machines - also see http://wiki.debian.net/?DebConf5TechMeetingAgenda
- <liiwi> vendor?
- <stockholm> 226G HD
- <stockholm> liiwi: damicron
- <stockholm> it runs comas and postgresql for now
- <liiwi> running already?
- <stockholm> we can put all other server tasks (like ldap dhcp etc) on it
- <stockholm> yes at comas.l-a.fi
- <liiwi> col
- <Q-FUNK> someone should invite ekix to this channel
- <liiwi> +o
- <stockholm> we *will* have that machine at debconf location
- <nchip> I have a 266Mhz ppc/250GB HD/gige embedded device running debian I can bring
- <stockholm> are we talking servers?
- <h01ger> stockholm, sponsored by damicron as well ?
- <stockholm> nchip: as a storage server?
- <Q-FUNK> damicon
- <stockholm> h01ger: proposed what?
- <nchip> stockholm: that's basicly the only thing it would be usefull for
- <stockholm> that it goes to the debconf location? yes
- <stockholm> nchip: i imagine it can do that just fine.
- <Q-FUNK> nchip: or a ppc pbuilder host.
- <h01ger> stockholm, ? my question was/is if that server is sponsored by damicron ?
- <stockholm> h01ger: oh, sorry. yes, it is
- <stockholm> it is sponsored.
- <stockholm> then there are two servers from HP, with 4cpus i think. unconfirmed.
- <stockholm> xeon and amd64
- <liiwi> how much disk?
- <h01ger> stockholm, for the damicron server, i would also want to know the location at HUT (we can of course talk about that later, when mooch is here)
- <stockholm> liiwi: unknown at present.
- <stockholm> i have been hunting the contact person, no luck
- <liiwi> h01ger: basement, damicon
- <stockholm> the whole location discussion... (c: i will keep out of that.
- * liiwi locks stockholm to the basement
- <stockholm> liiwi: (c:
- <h01ger> i'm taking notes at http://www.layer-acht.org/fai/fai-at-debconf5/ (at the botton)
- <nchip> Well, we have the whole camp week to find out if the basement is too hot or not :)
- <liiwi> so, we'll have at least three hefty boxes, and the big disk array for video is still needed
- <h01ger> though i might switch to paper (faster) sometime...
- <h01ger> liiwi, basement of the dorms ? which basement...
- <stockholm> can we store the raw data off-site?
- <stockholm> in umea, for example?
- <h01ger> umea ?
- <liiwi> umeAY
- <stockholm> maswan might have some capacity. he will be there (at debconf) too
- <stockholm> he is admin there
- <stockholm> and the network between the two unis is properly developed, i guess
- <liiwi> h01ger: one of the basement rooms at dorms, yes.
- <stockholm> just an idea
- <liiwi> nordunet is at least 2.5Gbit/s
- <stockholm> h01ger: there are two dotted rooms in the cellar drawing. one of those
- <liiwi> if not faster these days
- <Q-FUNK> atera is also an admin at the CSC. he canprobably help wit that.
- <liiwi> stockholm: I take it that someone has confirmed that we can use those rooms? :)
- <h01ger> stockholm, in each dorm building ;)
- <stockholm> liiwi: mooch thought we could use them too but asked again, i think
- <h01ger> liiwi, nordunet is 2.5gbit/s - does that mean 2.5gbit/s between the dorm buildings and smoekki and csd ?
- <liiwi> h01ger: no, uni to uni, inside the uni things may drop down to 100mbit.
- <stockholm> h01ger: nordunet is something like winshuttle in germany
- <stockholm> liiwi: we still dont know the bandwidths we have between places, do we?
- <liiwi> http://www.nordu.net/stat-q/load-map/ndn-map,,traffic,busy
- <liiwi> stockholm: correct
- <stockholm> liiwi: am i correct when assuming that the person at HUT is the blocker?
- --- hrobak (~herman@pat.opera.com) has joined channel #debconf-team
- <h01ger> liiwi: so the map shows finnland ? :)
- <stockholm> liiwi: not anwering moochs mail?
- <liiwi> h01ger: no, scandinavia + finland
- <liiwi> stockholm: have to talk to mooch to find out.
- <h01ger> liiwi: ok :)
- <stockholm> how can we make sure that we will not just be "frozen out" by that guy?
- * hrobak will be back on the channel in ~20 mins
- --- hrobak has left channel #debconf-team
- <stockholm> that we get there and everyone is on vacation and no one can make arrangements to fix stuff?
- <liiwi> stockholm: if you're talking about the head of CSD, we don't need anything from him anymore, afaik.
- <h01ger> stockholm, the video laptops are also unconfirmed at the moment ?
- <stockholm> liiwi: i talk about the networking boss
- <liiwi> stockholm: let's wait for mooch.
- <stockholm> h01ger: as far as i know they should be ok. but i asked today (after i heared about the servers) that they are checked
- <h01ger> stockholm, so i'll set the status to "should be ok" :)
- <stockholm> heh, yes
- --- ekix (eki@YZMMDCCCLXXXV.dsl.saunalahti.fi) has joined channel #debconf-team
- <stockholm> hi, ekix
- <ekix> hi
- <Q-FUNK> damicon entered the building
- <h01ger> could you please check the table (list of machines at debconf) at the botton of http://www.layer-acht.org/fai/fai-at-debconf5/ and tell me whats wrong and missing ?
- <stockholm> h01ger: looks good.
- <stockholm> i remember rumors about an ibm server
- * h01ger just asked svenl about the pegs
- <h01ger> stockholm, the other notebooks from intel are missing in this list.
- <stockholm> the ibm server should be a ppc64 smp machine
- <liiwi> Hey daveee, want to buy some pegs?
- <liiwi> <papa lazarous>
- <stockholm> h01ger: those are not "infrastructure" machines but leaves
- <ekix> liiwi, hi :)
- <liiwi> ekix: moro
- <h01ger> stockholm, i want ALL machines in this list. as fabbe wants all machines for insurance I want to plan the leaves as well. (they're less important yes, but still need care)
- <stockholm> h01ger: ok, add them, then (c:
- <h01ger> ok, and please tell me :) where those just two diffrent brands or two use cases as well ?
- <stockholm> h01ger: then you also forgot nchip's 250GB hd with network attached
- <stockholm> h01ger: can you pleaes rephrase that?
- <h01ger> i remember three different toshiba notebooks coming from intel ;) 1 type for video, the 2 others just get thrown out at people who requested them or were there other uses for them =
- <h01ger> s/=/?/
- <stockholm> h01ger: yes, that is what i frowarded to you and that is the information that i have so far
- <h01ger> stockholm, do you also remember who had the contacts to ibm (for the ppc64 server)
- <h01ger> stockholm, ok. i'll find that mail...
- <stockholm> h01ger: the noteboos were intended for the people who requested them
- <stockholm> h01ger: i think it was arto
- <stockholm> same as hp-contact
- <nchip> I also think it was Arto
- <stockholm> arto could not reach HP today
- <stockholm> he tried once
- <nchip> can we use bdale?
- <stockholm> nchip: no, he is not able to help as far as i know
- <stockholm> we talked about it allready
- <h01ger> arto has which nick ?
- <stockholm> not sure
- <nchip> that what I though too :(
- <stockholm> t..., i think
- * h01ger has updated http://www.layer-acht.org/fai/fai-at-debconf5/ again (with contacts to sponsors)
- <stockholm> h01ger: if i had cought him online during the last days i would perhaps know more.
- <DaCa-be> stockholm: teras ?
- <stockholm> no, it was more cryptic then that, i think
- <nchip> ateras
- * stockholm drums his fingers waiting for mooch
- <h01ger> so, if we get one (or two) 4cpus server from hp, the video team wants+needs one. at least. the whole streaming+editing thing is not really settled.
- <stockholm> and starts putting the list of volunteers together
- <h01ger> fabbe, are you around ?
- <stockholm> h01ger: can you tell me again why we need so much storage? why do we need the raw data?
- <Q-FUNK> h01ger: he's away all night
- <h01ger> stockholm, we calculated with 0.5tb a month or two ago. two weeks ago martinl raised the levels ;) thats basically all i know.
- <stockholm> h01ger: ok.
- --- h01ger has changed the topic on channel #debconf-team to "techmeeting - integration with comas - also see http://wiki.debian.net/?DebConf5TechMeetingAgenda
- <h01ger> stockholm, what do you ment exactly with that point ?
- <stockholm> h01ger: depending how secure we want to be, we need to hand out certs or keys to people
- <nchip> for wlan?
- <h01ger> for https or login ?
- <h01ger> nchip, for comas
- <stockholm> h01ger: or at least put stuff into radius for wps
- --- hrobak_ (herman@developer.skolelinux.no) has joined channel #debconf-team
- <stockholm> nchip: yes, for wlan for example.
- <h01ger> ahh... integrate the cert handling into comas ;)
- <h01ger> makes sense! :-) very much
- <stockholm> h01ger: we need at least a way to hand out the "trusted information"
- <h01ger> stockholm, yes.
- <stockholm> and comas is the only way we have for that right now.
- <stockholm> dondelelcaro: ?
- <stockholm> gwolf is busy right now.
- <stockholm> perhaps don can give us some insight
- <stockholm> i cant believe it: we seem to have only 5 finnish volunteers so far.
- <stockholm> i thought there was a sixth but i cant find him
- <stockholm> aparently i am loosing considerable parts of the workforce in my mailfolder. :-/
- <Q-FUNK> this is not a country of volunteers. they get drafted in, instead.
- <stockholm> lol. ok
- <nchip> can we setup a "volunteer2005@debconf.org" email account, which we can tell potential volunteers to announce themselfs?
- <stockholm> yes, sure. i bet it is 30sec work for liw.
- <nchip> currently it is not very clear where to send potential volunteers
- <tuukkah> a managing person would be better, right?
- <tuukkah> (ot: but where to find one...)
- <stockholm> tuukkah: well a managing person that finds tons of volunteers would be best (c:
- * h01ger wants to stay on topic (and rather have a break between this meeting and the next), but it's hard without mooch. on topic would be: physical network topology, logical network topology, how to install, how to update, integration with comas, video setup in the topologies...
- <h01ger> .oO( or have a break now )
- <stockholm> h01ger: no, we can continue with the how to install etc bit
- <stockholm> h01ger: the thing with the servers is that they need to interact with each other.
- <stockholm> nss-ldap and pam-ldap
- <h01ger> jup. from the 5 topics i have left, 3 have the word "topology" in them ;) which also includes inter-action ;)
- <stockholm> h01ger: if you can automate that before hand that would be best
- <nchip> so wlan will be protected with WPA? we'll need to start learning how to setup wpa_supllicant :E
- <Q-FUNK> iwconfig
- <stockholm> Q-FUNK: not quite. (c:
- <h01ger> secure wlan is a nice-to-have-feature on our list. if we dont make it, tunnel everything with ssh...
- <stockholm> nchip: we will provide a config snipplet
- --- h01ger has changed the topic on channel #debconf-team to "techmeeting - how to install the machines - also see http://wiki.debian.net/?DebConf5TechMeetingAgenda
- <stockholm> the address is volunteers@lists.debconf.org
- <nchip> which redirects the mails to where?
- <h01ger> i was thinking about using skolelinux (sarge) or sarge (for all machines). now i'm thinking more towards using sarge, that is, the normal installer cds/whatevers plus preseeding to get rid of most questions...
- <stockholm> h01ger: so ldap is quite important and we need to have tls to the ldap server
- <stockholm> nchip: it is a mailing list. at present i am subscribed
- * nchip subscribes
- <tuukkah> are outside posts allowed and should volunteers subscribe? and is the list public to subscribe or read archives?
- <stockholm> h01ger: what services do we want?
- <stockholm> tuukkah: not sure, ask liw.
- <h01ger> "tls to the server" means exactly ? port 636 ?
- <h01ger> tuukkah, stockholm, nchip: please discuss this later or somewhere else ;)
- <nchip> sorry :)
- <h01ger> stockholm, which services do we want were ? i also want to add those to the list (at layer-acht.org/fai/fai-at-debconf5). (it's super-easy (no work) to install those services on the machines with fai-softupdates after the install)
- <liiwi> tuukkah: moderated, and yes.
- * stockholm comes back from his son's good night procedure, sorry
- <stockholm> h01ger: pardon?
- <stockholm> what list?
- <stockholm> the table?
- <h01ger> yes
- <stockholm> heh, moment
- * stockholm checks the debian-edu services
- <h01ger> you might s/machines/clients/
- <h01ger> but even the server services are real easy to deploy... (just not super easy) :-)
- <stockholm> flood!
- <stockholm> *
- <stockholm> Centralized logging [syslog]
- <stockholm> *
- <stockholm> DNS(Bind?)[domain]
- <stockholm> *
- <stockholm> Automatic networkconfiguration of machines(DHCP)[bootps]
- <stockholm> *
- <stockholm> Clocksynchronization (NTP)[ntp]
- <stockholm> *
- <stockholm> Home directories via network file system (SMB/NFS/Appletalk)[homes]
- <stockholm> *
- <stockholm> Elektronic postoffice(Limacute) [postoffice]
- <stockholm> *
- <stockholm> Directoryservice(OpenLDAP)[ldap]
- <stockholm> *
- <stockholm> Webserver (Apache/PHP/eZ)[www]
- <stockholm> *
- <stockholm> SQL server (PostgreSQL)[database]
- <stockholm> *
- <stockholm> Central backup (?) [backup]
- <stockholm> *
- <stockholm> Web-cache / proxy (Squid)[webcache]
- <stockholm> *
- <stockholm> Printing(CUPS) [ipp]
- <stockholm> *
- <stockholm> Remote login (OpenSSH) [ssh]
- <stockholm> *
- <stockholm> Automatic configuring [cfengine]
- <stockholm> *
- <stockholm> Thin client servers (LTSP) [ltsp-server-\#]
- <stockholm> *
- <stockholm> Machine- and service surveillance with error reporting, + status and history on the web. Error reporting by mail.
- * hrobak_ is a bit uncertain about eZ and Limacute...
- <stockholm> we dont need the "Thin client servers" and the surveillance, and squid
- <stockholm> hrobak_: we need a mailserver.
- <h01ger> stockholm, that was not flood. that was marketing speech flood ;) - thanx for the list! :-)
- <stockholm> h01ger: just to give you ideas of what services are rather basic and most likely necessary
- <hrobak_> stockholm: Is Limacute there, and does it work out of the box? (I have not heard of any schools using it)
- <stockholm> hrobak_: i dont know
- <h01ger> stockholm, is this config allready installed (as i understand it, the machine is allready in use as the comas server (or a comas test server) or do we still have to install it ? for this server it might be sensible to install it with skolelinux sarge... but in general i would rather like to install plain sarge and tweak it with fai.
- <h01ger> s/it might be/is/
- <stockholm> h01ger: we might reinstall the server anyway, with amd64.
- <h01ger> and there is no amd64 port of skolelinux ? or is there ?
- <stockholm> h01ger: but that would mean that we cant install skolelinux as it exists today
- <h01ger> stockholm, ?
- <stockholm> yes: no amd64 port of debian edu
- <h01ger> ok :)
- <h01ger> ok, still should be no big problem as we can rip the configs from an x86 install ;) (or start debianedu amd64 ;)
- <stockholm> h01ger: for some parts you need to configure both client and server.
- <liiwi> sfs for homedirs
- <stockholm> agreed
- <h01ger> sfs ? samba ?
- <stockholm> liiwi: can you supply configs?
- <stockholm> h01ger: secure file system
- <liiwi> uh, no configs needed, exports at most
- <stockholm> unfortunatly afs is still not included.
- <h01ger> whats the debian package for sfs ?
- <stockholm> h01ger: so you will prepare fai configs for the server and of the clients?
- <liiwi> sfs-{server,client}
- <stockholm> someone needs to write some documentation for people to use, how to tie into the network
- <h01ger> stockholm, yes. i'll prepare some configs and instructions and give svn commit access to people who need it. and i have svn commit mails activated so i can monitor all commits.
- <stockholm> what about radius and wpa?
- <h01ger> liiwi, thanx.
- <h01ger> liiwi, stockholm: have you read the bits about fai on layer-acht.org/fai/fai-at-debconf/ ?
- <stockholm> i never set up radius
- <nchip> does radius need to be available, when intel people come to setup wlan?
- <h01ger> i'll work on the fai configdir (and docs how to "play" with it) from thursday til saturday, as i have other work tommorrow and the day after.
- <stockholm> nchip: i dont know if that is needed. i dont know much more then what it provides. not how it works or how it ties in with other services
- --- teroajk (~teroajk@GMMCCCXLV.dsl.saunalahti.fi) has joined channel #debconf-team
- <stockholm> teroajk: ahhh!
- <liiwi> morjens
- <stockholm> teroajk: ibm server? hp server?
- <teroajk> stockholm: ateras perhaps?
- <stockholm> lol
- <teroajk> stockholm: You seem to confuse us two a lot ;)
- <stockholm> i will learn
- <stockholm> i see you two too infrequently!
- <stockholm> anyone with radius expertise who could set that up?
- * liiwi hides
- <stockholm> ah, thanks!
- <liiwi> need local box running for htat
- * stockholm drags liiwi to the stage
- <liiwi> and where do we get passwords?
- <stockholm> liiwi: from comas
- <liiwi> sql?
- <stockholm> liiwi: tell our comas people what you need. you could tie in directly into postgresql
- <liiwi> who are they?
- <stockholm> gwolf@d.o and don@d.o
- * liiwi suspects the schemas do not match at all
- <h01ger> installation and updates are clear to me now, to you as well ?
- <stockholm> make a view (c:
- <liiwi> with different hashes..
- <liiwi> mmm, hash
- <stockholm> perhaps we shoudl not use nss-ldap but nss-psql? does it exist?
- <h01ger> which leads to three topics left: physical topology, logical topology, video
- <liiwi> MOOCH, HERE NOW
- <stockholm> amazing how he manages to miss key meetings with top precision.
- <stockholm> (c:
- <h01ger> stockholm, i dunno for sure if i completly understand: but i rather dont want the sql-db exposed to the whole network...
- <stockholm> no, me either.
- <stockholm> ldap would be better for that.
- <h01ger> but wouldnt nss-psql mean exactly that ?
- <stockholm> liiwi: can radius bind to ldap, too?
- <liiwi> yes, or pam
- <stockholm> nss and pam are not the same things
- <stockholm> you need both
- <liiwi> I know
- <slef> stockholm++
- <stockholm> (c:
- <stockholm> sorry
- <stockholm> *giggle*
- --- h01ger has changed the topic on channel #debconf-team to "techmeeting - waiting for mooch (physical topology, logical topology, video) - also see http://wiki.debian.net/?DebConf5TechMeetingAgenda and http://layer-acht.org/fai/fai-at-debconf5/
- * h01ger takes a break^Hth
- * h01ger proposes to take a break til 19 UTC and declare this meeting finished.
- <stockholm> ok
- * stockholm reads the "graphical installer" thread and falls over laughing